Visit this blog regarding the Willow Creek model. This was sent to me by my dear friend Nicole after reading the lyrics to 21 (see post below). See also http://wiseserpents.blogspot.com/.
The day after Nicole sent me the above link, I had an incredible dinner conversation with a friend (hereinafter known as "Friend" for confidentiality sake) over a very bland Oklahoma crab boil. Friend is a small town, big church youth minister who is unafraid to ask some very difficult questions, including "why is this crab so darned bland? Didn't they put any crab boil in here?" We began discussing church programming and he intimated that constant programming hasn't really done much for his youth's spiritual growth. In fact, it hasn't even added that many new, committed youth. We then began discussing re-thinking bible-belt church and bibl-belt language. Which led me to the following questions:
What if we could shell all of the programs and all of the church language (i.e. "saved") and begin to explain Christianity at a relational level? What if we stopped feeding our selves with pot-lucks, and revivals, and VBS's, and started serving the school districts in which our churches are situated? What if we stopped throwing money at projection screens and started throwing it toward community clean-ups and homeless ministries? Would that make a difference in the number of believers that came to faith? Would that faith be more authentic, more genuine? Would it eventually make a difference in the spiritual depth of believers that are raised up in the church?
My questions for you:
(1) what kind of church do you attend? Is it program driven (i.e. pizza blasts, revivals, sponsored super bowl parties, special events)? If so, do you think it is effective in "making disciples?";
(2) If you don't attend a program driven church, what does your church do to make disciples? How do you get into the community?
I need answers here. I think the boys in Mozambique should also put their two cents in the hat. Come on Kyle and Rusty, you can be part of my church.
Comment here, or on the "21" post... Just comment.
4 comments:
See this: http://vintagechristianity.wordpress.com/2008/05/01/hotdogs-for-jesus/
And this: http://www.imagodeicommunity.com/article/love-portland/
I know of another church in Tulsa who is taking the call to serve their community by serving their schools. They have volunteered to sub in a time a tragedy (a teacher died and they manned the school so the teachers could go to the funeral). They have cleaned the school. In short, they have shelled programming in favor of service. Seems like a neighborly gospel to me.
Well my church isn't really in the evangelical mold at all, so I have a bit of a church-culture barrier to cross.
However, my finding is that there's something of what I call a "negative reciprocity" between member-making churches and disciple-making churches. Namely, vapid worship is very inviting, but not terribly nourishing to the initiated.
Reaching out too often involves dumbing down, or attempting to relate on emotive levels to the exclusion of intellectual layers. Not that this must be the case, only that I have found it to be the circular trap many churches find themselves in. People sign up for the cheap Christianity they were evangelized with (because it was offered at bargain price), but are turned off when it becomes more patently obvious that they've been duped, and that authenticity will demand more.
Perhaps what we really need is to challenge people more up front. To represent something incarnationally and palbably different than the world around us. It strikes me that the #1 problem in getting people to the faith these days is that they really don't see it doing a whole lot besides forming a few personal bonds with others. It's becoming a way for a disconnected people to come into community, and that's a good thing, but many can't tell ultimately why THIS brand of community matters, and wonder why they couldn't get the same thing somewhere else that didn't involve all of the 'faith stuff'.
Blame your wife for me popping up :)
-Ray
Seth,
I can honestly say that I have no internal need to be "vintage" (yeah, it's a bit of a gag-reflex word with me as well). For me it has more to do with a combination of anti-(consumerism/materialism/emotivism/otherisms I'm not thinking of right now), and also with a true appreciation for the benefits that come with a worship style that is organically connected to a long-standing Christian faith tradition (the oldest, actually).
I think GK Chesterton said it best in his book The Joy of Orthodoxy (by which he meant creedal belief, as he was Catholic): "Tradition means giving votes to the most obscure of all classes, our ancestors. It is the democracy of the dead. Tradition refuses to submit to the small and arrogant oligarchy of those who merely happen to be walking about."
right-o
I can certainly sympathize or rather empathize with these thoughts on churches. It's been up for debate in my circle of friends lately. I think a mix of missionary mindedness, both locally and globally, is a must. Our church currently is considered a "missional" church (not my word, I don't think it is a word frankly). It's the mindset our pastor has envisioned for our congregation. We read a book called "Breaking the Missional Code" by Ed Setzer and David Putman. At first I didn't like it and criticized it for its made up words like "missional". But then I heard Ed speak and I see a lot of truth in the book now.
But honestly based on the rhetoric going around our church home, I think the best approach is one of living life with others. Whether they be Xn or not. Living life with others is the best way to draw people closer to God. Look at Jesus, case in point.
Being tolerant of their differences, recognizing their situation for what it is (usually a coping mechanicism) and loving them first. Living life with them first...building trust and a true friendship is the only way.
Granted I ain't no Jesus, but I know for a fact, touching others lives with no hidden agenda works every time. People see the difference and they are drawn to it. Don't ask, let them. And just love them. Love them even if it hurts.
Money wise, I agree, we Xns are all about spending the bucks to make our environment more comfortable. It's such a waste. But what can you do? I mean it is, what it is.
Take a look at our church if you want...we just spent millions on a free gym/hang out spot for our community. I've seen it make a difference. It's different and maybe not something I would have thought of but it's working to help tie the community to us and us to the community.
Just my 2 cents.
www.councilroad.org
I'm proud of our church, we have a mission minded (both locally and globally) group leading us and although it's been a struggle to get some of the comfortable Baptists to see what we need to do to reach out, it's working and the tide is turning slowly and surely.
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